Episode 50 – How Product Licensing Created a Successful 7-Figure Amazon FBA Seller

Meet Paul Miller, an ex-struggling franchise restaurant owner turned 7-figure Amazon FBA seller. Learn how a major product licensing deal led him to success early in the game. Get in-depth into how it all came to be and all its major benefits, such as a built-in fan base and Fortune-500 legal protection.

In episode 50 of the Serious Sellers Podcast Bradley and Paul discuss:

• 01:30 – A Great Amazon Story, but Not Without Challenges
• 02:45 – In 2015 and with 2 Struggling Franchised Restaurants, the Recession Hits
• 04:25 – Plan A Starts to Show Some Cracks – Selling on Amazon Becomes Plan B
• 05:18 – Kick-Ball Heroics Lead to a Hospital Visit and Plenty of Time to Study Amazon
• 06:40 – In 3 Months on Amazon He Had Replaced His Previous Income
• 09:17 – What Allowed Him to be Successful Right Off the Bat
• 11:00 – Unlike Many, He’s Still Selling His First Product
• 14:47 – Reaching Out to Friends for Business Advice – Licensing was an Early Suggestion
• 16:00 – Nickelodeon was His First Major Licensing Deal
• 17:15 – How Exactly Does Product Licensing Work?
• 20:57 – If You Get It Right, There’s a Big Financial Upside
• 22:35 – Bradley – “Any Hiccups Along the Way?”
• 26:10 – Moving Forward, Licensing Continues to be a Big Part of His Amazon Plan
• 27:00 – Benefits – Big Built-In Fan Base and Powerful Brand Protection (With Teeth) 
• 31:05 – The AMPM Podcast – “How Cool is That?”
• 31:50 – His Use of Helium 10 – Profit Tools and Alerts are Favorites
• 34:13 – How to Get More Information on Licensing and Contact Paul

Enjoy this episode? Be sure to check out our previous episodes for even more content to propel you to Amazon FBA Seller success! And don’t forget to “Like” our Facebook page and subscribe to the podcast on iTunes, Google Play or wherever you listen to our podcast.

Want to absolutely start crushing it on Amazon? Here are few carefully curated resources to get you started:

• Freedom Ticket: Taught by Amazon thought leader Kevin King, get A-Z Amazon strategies and techniques for establishing and solidifying your business.
• Ultimate Resource Guide: Discover the best tools and services to help you dominate on Amazon.
• Helium 10: 20+ software tools to boost your entire sales pipeline from product research to customer communication and Amazon refund automation. Make running a successful Amazon business easier with better data and insights. See what our customers have to say.
• Helium 10 Chrome Extension: Verify your Amazon product idea and validate how lucrative it can be with over a dozen data metrics and profitability estimation. 
• SellerTradmarks.com: Trademarks are vital for protecting your Amazon brand from hijackers, and sellertrademarks.com provides a streamlined process for helping you get one.

Transcript

Bradley Sutton: Guess what, guys? This is episode 50 of the Serious Sellers Podcast. So we’ve got a special guest today and he’s got a great story. He went from being injured and unable to work to fully replacing his income within three months, and now, he runs a seven-figure brand that utilizes a simple yet powerful technique that almost no one in the private-label space takes advantage of. And he’s going to share it with us today. How cool is that? Pretty cool, I think.

Bradley Sutton: How’s it going, everybody? Welcome to another episode of the Serious Sellers Podcast. My name is Bradley Sutton, and I’m joined today by Paul Miller. Paul, how’s it going?

Paul Miller: Hey Bradley. Great to be here. Going great!

Bradley Sutton: All right. It’s great to have you on here. For those who don’t know, Paul and I go a couple of years back, at least virtually.  We were in the ZonSquad Group together, a little mastermind group, and then, we actually met, I believe in person for the first time, last year at SellerCon, right?

Paul Miller: That’s right. That’s right.

Bradley Sutton: Yeah. Yeah. And then now, we were just talking about how sad that we’re not going to be able to see each other this month at SellerCon, but because of you, now I’m good friends with Andy, Liran—That was pretty much because of Mr. Paul Miller.  So I have you to thank for a lot of things.

Paul Miller: I love connecting great people, Bradley, and you’re one of the best.

Bradley Sutton: Oh, thank you. I appreciate that. And speaking of one of the best, you’ve got one of the best stories. It’s not something that is like all—what’s the word?—rainbows and unicorns. You had some struggles, but what’s really inspiring about it is how you pulled through, and we’re definitely going to be talking about one of your specialties, which is licensing, which I think—I would say—99% of sellers might not even ever consider. We’ll talk about some of your successes there, but first, let’s just talk about your Amazon journey in general, because it’s not like you’ve been selling on Amazon for 20 years. You started a few years back. What were some of the steps in your life that led you to this whole Amazon?

Paul Miller: Well, speaking of SellerCon, I’m going to kind of take this back to when we finally met in person at SellerCon. The reason I was there was because I was invited to be on stage and share my story, which started with the course run by amazing.com which was what they call that—awesome, no. What was the name of that course, Bradley? Do you remember?

Bradley Sutton: The ASM?

Paul Miller: Yeah, ASM. Amazing Selling Machine. Sorry, it slipped my mind. There’s so many courses out there now. So in 2015, I was running three of my own franchise restaurants, and honestly, it wasn’t going well. I had built two stores in 2008, and that was the beginning of the recession. I was really struggling with getting those two stores to be profitable, which we’re taking away from my one profitable store. And for several years, I was struggling and I knew, in 2015, I was basically down to my last restaurant and trying to figure out a plan B if I couldn’t rescue it.

Bradley Sutton: What kind of restaurants? I’ve heard you tell this story before, but I never asked.

Paul Miller: They were franchise pizza restaurants. That’s about all I should say.

Bradley Sutton: Nice, pizza. Hey, I like pizza.

Paul Miller: Pizza buffet restaurants. If you think really hard, you’ll figure it out.

Bradley Sutton: Yeah, I think I got it.

Paul Miller: So, these were basically full-service restaurants—4,000-5,000 square feet each. They take a lot . . . Each one would have 20 or 30 employees. I had about 75 employees, nine managers, one district manager. It was a pretty big organization at the time. We worked really hard for our money. Okay. So, as I mentioned it, sales declined. We got rid of the restaurants one by one. We had this one restaurant leftover, which I was going to go in and be the general manager of—basically, fire all the management staff. I was going to be the GM and to try to rescue this store. Well, I wasn’t quite sure that I’d be able to pull it off, so I thought I would have to have a plan B, and my plan B was basically to see about this selling on Amazon. In my nighttime, I started taking the course, ASM course, and I was pretty excited about it. I didn’t really have a product yet or anything. And then in May of 2015, I took a break from the restaurant, which was, by the way, about 120 miles from my home. So I was actually living away from home in somebody’s carport apartment, trying to rescue this restaurant, but I had taken a break. Came home for my daughter’s 16th birthday, we went out to dinner—her favorite sushi restaurant—and after that, I took my son to cub scouts where we went to go play kickball. The coach, or not the coach, but the den leader asked me if I would be the pitcher for kickball.

Paul Miller: I did that. I pitched a couple of balls, and I think it was the fourth kid up. This 10-year-old kicks a line dry right towards me, and you’ve got to catch the ball to get the kid out. I did a diving catch, held onto the ball with two hands, hit the ground. I kind of rolled over onto one knee, and I knew something was wrong at that moment. And what happened was I had just completely crushed my collar bone. I just sat down on one knee going, “Oh man, this is really not good.” All I could think about is “I’m not going to be able to work.” All right, that’s it. I’m going to be finished in the restaurant business. Well, the den leader’s wife took me to the emergency room, and I got diagnosed and everything. It was a really bad fracture. It would take surgery and it would take a long recovery period. And all I did during my recovery was study Amazon. I had basically called up the franchisor owner for my restaurant. I said, “Look, I’m done. You guys let me get through this summer. I’ll hire some temporary management, and you guys take the keys because I can’t do it anymore.” So I had about three months to learn how to make money on Amazon. That was May 2015 and by August of 2015, I had replaced my income.

Bradley Sutton: Wow. So June, July, three months, we’re talking here?

Paul Miller: Believe it or not. Yeah, it was crazy. So, well, I was able to replace my income, and I was full time. Yeah, in about three to four months.

Bradley Sutton: Are you selling your first products still?

Paul Miller: Oh, yeah. I’m still selling my first products.

Bradley Sutton: A lot of people might swing and miss on their first try, but you knocked it out of the park on your first product that you chose.

Paul Miller: Well, the funny thing was it wasn’t actually the first product that I had in mind. I started with this product that was easily available, but my big idea was a food-service-type product that I was familiar with and I wanted to develop. As I went along, I found that the cost to make that device was just prohibitive to me. I was pretty much broke. We needed the plastic molds and everything else that would’ve cost too much money. The product we ended up being successful with was really the plan B product.

Bradley Sutton: Okay. Yeah.

Paul Miller: That turned into my plan A.  We continued to make different variations, different styles, and marketed it to a different audience. And it really grew to be a fantastic product.

Bradley Sutton: Wow, that’s great. So what year again was the actual launch? Was it 2017?

Paul Miller: No, no, that was 2015.

Bradley Sutton: Two years in the future there. So 2015, you’re still recovering, and you’re just studying all you can about Amazon, which it’s something I think a lot of should definitely take heed. Not necessarily that everybody needs to pay for courses. I paid for the courses. I think they’re great, but studying doesn’t mean necessarily paying for courses, guys. There is so much content. Probably not in 2015, but nowadays, there’s so much content out there that’s even free for people who might not have the budget for a course; they should absolutely do.

Bradley Sutton: But what made you successful right off the bat?  What were some of the things that helped? Was it your product choice, the way you made your listings, the way you launched it, your PPC strategy, or all of the above? What was it for you?

Paul Miller: I’m going to say all of the above, and then, I’ll highlight a couple of things. A lot of it really was a community, and as you know, probably later in that year of 2015, I joined ZonSquad, but before that, I was a member of something called The Tribe. And so, having access to that group of successful people was really, really important to me. I did get lucky I think with my first product that I picked, and I think everybody knows my brand anyway, so I’ll mention it; CozyPhones. I’ve been on many podcasts and mentioned it. It was a sleeping headphone. We had taken that product, which is something that I actually used a lot to listen to podcasts and things at night, and we made it a better product. We made different styles, different colors, and really it was a much better listing than what was out there at the time. And then of course, I studied PPC. I actually didn’t do any of the launch giveaways at that time. We really grew organically with better listings and some better pricing at the time and better variations than anybody else had.

Bradley Sutton: That’s great. I never really realized that was your first product, and I think even I would venture to say that everybody I have interviewed here when I ask “are you still selling your first product?” They say “no.” So, they’re all very successful now, but I think only very few have been able to stick with it on that product. And that’s a great testament too, because even I was just talking to a Tim Jordan the other day, and he was like, “yeah, that’s a newish product.” But you know, he stopped selling like after six months in. And for a lot of people, that’s fine. They find something that hot, they sell it for a while, but then, everybody else jumps on and then your price goes down. It’s just not very profitable to keep selling it. Which brings me in a completely unintentional segue way here. One of the reasons I think why you have been able to stay on top of the game all this time is because, after a while, you started getting into licensing. So can you talk about that transition? First of all, how you even had the idea about licensing and then how you incorporated it into your headphone line.

Paul Miller: Sure. Yeah, I’m happy to talk about that. So well, as I mentioned, we had adult sleeping headphones, which is basically a stretchy headband with the soft thin speakers embedded in the headband. And what I had done, I think it was probably fall of 2015, as I had a photoshoot with my photographer and putting these on some adults and getting good listing pictures done when my photographer put the headphones on her daughter, 10-year-old daughter, with her tablet in her hands and she took some pictures and that was my Aha! moment. I was like, “Wow, I wonder if this would be good for kids.” And so what I did is I asked my daughter, who is an artist, to create several designs. I think we did a puppy, a bunny, and a frog. And I took the frog drawing that she did, a simple illustration, and send it to my manufacturer.

Paul Miller: I said, “Hey, can you make this?” And she made me some samples, and I placed a small order, and I put those kid’s version—kid’s frog headband headphones—on my adult version listing as a variation. And when the adults saw that, even though they were shopping for adult sleep headphones, they said, “Wow, that could be a good product for my child.” And we started getting great feedback right away. So this is a category that really never existed before. I’ll put in a side note here. Its patent-pending. So we hope that our patent will be issued I assume within the next three to six months. That’s the character headband headphones. And so we got this great feedback from our audience and solved lots of problems for folks. Kids that don’t like earbuds or over-the-ear headphones, and they’re soft, comfortable; they stay on; you can take a nap with them on; all this great feedback. So we decided to expand that line. And we were just really going gangbusters, and I was very excited about it. I started calling around to friends of mine to say, “Hey, we’ve got something really interesting here, hot product. How can we grow and protect it?” Because we know, as you do, those Amazon sellers are ruthless and if they can think about a way to copy you or knock you off and get ahead of you, they will. One person that I called gave me the advice and said, “Hey, you should look into licensing.” And what he meant by that is we could go to companies like Nickelodeon or Disney, Hasbro, and we can license the right to put those characters on our headphones. So I started small. I went out to the licensing expo in Las Vegas where I met a woman who was a children’s book author and she had a character called the What If Monster. And the character fit perfectly onto our headphones. So that was our first license. We licensed that, and we still have it. And it’s one of our primary characters. So we had the What If Monster; that was a successful license. Basically, a license is when you have a contract with somebody else to use their intellectual property. In this case, it was a design of her monster, and we could put those onto our headphones, and then we pay her back with royalty from the sales. So that was our first license. It worked out great. And it led to another, our first major license, which was with Nickelodeon. Fortunately, through a licensing consultant, I connected with some folks from Nickelodeon; I visited with them in New York. They liked the product. They were very forward-thinking – a small brand like mine. And we got our first major license with a set of characters called PAW Patrol, which is honestly one of the biggest kids series out there. So it’s in the top five licenses worldwide. So we were very fortunate to get that license and we added those characters to our line, and that’s the beginning of our licensing.

Bradley Sutton: Explain typical licensing deals; how does a brand or entity or TV show, celebrity, whatever—how do they choose who to grant a license? Is it exclusive? What are the different types of arrangements? I’ve heard sometimes it’s “every sale, we’ll pay you a percentage” or some others are a flat fee; can you go a little bit more into detail on how this works, because I would say most of our listeners probably have never thought about this.

Paul Miller: Sure. You know, it’s been a big learning curve for me, and it’s not simple, and it’s not for the beginner, and it’s not cheap to do either. But let’s cast it in the light of some licenses that you’re probably already really familiar with. One of the ones that we talk about—sometimes I’ve been asked to talk about licensing from time to time—is George Foreman Grill. Rick Cesari is the marketer or behind the George Foreman Grill. And that was basically a kitchen appliance with a license to use the name George Foreman on it and to use George as the personality. The way that a license typically works is that you’ve got a product that you want to pair with the property, the property being in that case, George Foreman or PAW Patrol, Mickey Mouse, Marvel— whatever it might be.  And it doesn’t have to be just in kids’ entertainment. If you think about cooking products, for example, a lot of them have celebrity chefs on them. Those are also a license. If you start thinking about licensing and you walk through the big box stores, you’re going to see licensing all over the place. But the way the licensee and licensor relationship works, if I’m the owner of the product, I’m the licensee; the owner of the property is considered the licensor. They are going to grant me a license to use that character or that property on my product for a specific line of products over a period of time. That would be the life of the agreement—let’s just say it’s three years—and the compensation that I’m going to give that to them is usually in the form of a royalty.  And usually, they call it a minimum guaranteed royalty. It could be a three-year contract with a minimum guaranteed royalty of x amount over that three years, and that’s a royalty that I owe them, whether or not I sell anything at all; it’s like a contract that I have to pay them the minimum based on my sales of that product.

Bradley Sutton: That’s probably one of the bigger risks then in this thing; you’re committing to pay this and you’re hoping that you can sell, but if you don’t sell as much as you think, you still owe that money. Right.

Paul Miller: Exactly. You still owe it, and a lot of times you owe it, it could be broken down even by the quarter, like, “Hey, your minimum guarantee is $30,000 for a three-year contract. So you owe us $10,000 a year” or even broken down into the quarter where you have to pay quarterly. So yeah, that’s definitely a risk and an investment that you’ve got to be willing to take. And then on top of that, usually, to sign the contract, they want you to give them an advance on the minimum guarantee. So on that $30,000 contract, you might have to give 30% in advance. That’s their way of saying that you’ve got skin in the game. You’re not just going to sit on that license and not do anything.

Bradley Sutton: Okay. Now, we might have just scared a lot of people away. Like, “Oh my goodness, these numbers, I can never do that.” But on the flip side, let’s talk about your 2018 sales, thanks to licensing. And I think you only had one major line of products, if I’m not mistaken, but what were your sales last year?

Paul Miller: In 2018, just keep in mind that we’re on amazon.com, cozyphones.com, walmart.com, Amazon Europe, and Amazon Canada. I was on—also a little bit—I think on eBay and Etsy. So across all channels, we were just under 6 million.

Bradley Sutton: Okay. Now, I think we brought everybody back to feeling better.

Paul Miller: Let me go back. There’s one thing that you said though because I also like to tell people that you don’t have to start big with a Nickelodeon or something. The What If Monster license that I did was zero down payment. Right? Really no MG (minimum guarantee), we had a very simple licensing agreement. This lady Michelle who has that character,  she’s got a fan base of 50,000 people. She was out there promoting her character on our headbands too. You don’t have to start really big. You could even have a licensing deal with an influencer, for example. You can work your way up to it. It is kind of scary when you think about doing one with somebody like a big player, like a Disney or a Nickelodeon. But there’s plenty of ways to get started smaller.

Bradley Sutton: Okay, good to know. Now let’s talk a little bit more into detail, maybe on some of the things or hiccups that you’ve had along the way with licensing or that you think people should be aware of. Like, “Hey, don’t forget about the small print or make sure this clause is there,” but what are some of the things that maybe you’ve learned along the way? Hopefully not trial by error, all of them. But just maybe learning from other people, but that will help our listeners if they’re trying to get into this. What are some of the common mistakes that people need to be aware of?

Paul Miller: Well, first of all, you’re really do need to understand the contract, right? And the minimum guarantee and what that means—as you said, that’s a liability. That’s a risk you take upfront. So number one is to understand the contract and the cost involved. And you need to understand that this is not your regular product development process. When you’re doing product development on licensing, that licensor is your partner. And so if you sign, say, a two-year license with somebody and it takes you six months to get a product to market, you just wasted 25% of your contract time. You might want to say, for example, that “okay, we’re going to build in six months or three months or whatever of product development time before the clock starts ticking on the royalty agreement.”  Understanding product development with the licensor is really big. It takes approvals. A process takes probably longer and more money than you’re used to doing in terms of making private label products on your own. Manufacturing is a big one too, because you may be required to have a factory audit, and if your factory cannot pass the audit, if you go and sign a contract and the contract says you’ve got to pass the audit and your supplier can’t pass it, then you’ve got to go find a new supplier.

Bradley Sutton: Wow. Yeah. I would imagine we can—as private label seller—sometimes we’ll make a nice listing, but when it’s actually the package, we put it in a little mailer or a Ziploc bag or something that’s not very professional, because we’re not so concerned about branding. Of course, you always should be concerned about branding, but we can still get away with it. But when it comes to licensing, we’ve got to be really on point with our packaging.

Paul Miller: That’s another great point, Bradley. Usually, you’re going to have to get your packaging approved as well, and you’re representing their brand, and let’s face it, the consumer doesn’t know you’re even in the mix. Most of the time, when they see the product, it says Disney on it, they think that Disney is manufacturing that product. They don’t know it’s just a license. The licensor is going to be really careful to make sure that you’re representing their brand correctly. Another aspect of things that you have to be careful about is marketing. Many times, you’re going to be required to get approvals on any kind of marketing that you’re doing for that product, because, again, you’re representing that brand, and they want to make sure that the marketing is on message for them.

Bradley Sutton: Okay, that makes sense. What are your plans for the future? Obviously you’ve totally crushed it with this, with this one license and with the relationship you’ve got with Nickelodeon, but are you trying to exclusively focus only on licensing deals as you expand your offerings or are you still planning to do just the traditional private label route? What are your plans for 2019?

Paul Miller: We continue to expand on both routes. We do what we call our CozyPhones originals, which honestly are still our top sellers. We will continue to develop our own different characters as well as licensing. So it’s a mix. Obviously, licensing gets you a big boost because you appeal to this huge audience of fans of whatever that character or product is. And it also helps you to protect your product, because, for example, if you have a product with the license on—I’m trying to think of a good example now. The coffee cup was a little bit too generic, but if you’re the only one with a coffee cup with some character on it, let’s say a Mickey Mouse, the licensor is not likely to give the same license to multiple manufacturers of the same product. You have a little monopoly on that license. If I have PAW Patrol Cozy Phones, nobody else is going to have that character or my product type. Now, that’s not really exclusive. They, don’t like giving exclusives, but in general, they’re not going to give that same license out diluted across many products. So it gives you a lot of protection that way.

Paul Miller: And then, also, if you’re worried about getting counterfeits, you’ve got a lot of horsepower behind you. Nickelodeon, for example, can support you in defending your IP rights on that character, because people are less likely to try to knock off a licensed character than they are with say an original CozyPhones.

Bradley Sutton: Yeah. Yeah. Now I just thought of something else right now; I’m not sure if you have experience in this, but I’m sure you know about it. I’m pretty sure this is a part of licensing but are their cases where like, let’s say Game of Thrones and we’re talking about Game of Throne lunchboxes, but instead of you paying them the royalties and this and that, the arrangement is you actually manufacture it, but then HBO wants to sell those lunchboxes that you manufactured on their website? How does that work?

Paul Miller: Well yes, I’m not sure if it could be part of the license. For example, they would say if it’s HBO who owns the rights, which they do, that would be part of the license that says, “Hey, we’re going to give you a license to sell in these type of channels. Right? Because that’s part of the licenses where you can sell it. And by the way, we want to have the right to purchase or provide these for sale on our website at whatever the wholesale rate is.” So that can be part of it. That reminds me of another interesting arrangement that you can do. Let’s say, they are working with a retailer, like Target or something like that. You can have a license lined up, a Disney license or somebody and say, “Look, I want to offer you an exclusive on this product with that license for a period of time.” We’re talking to Target or whoever, and then you go to the licensor and you say, “Hey look, I’ve got Target on board to offer this product if you give me the license.” It turns into a three-way deal where the retailer is benefiting from having an exclusive product and the licensor is benefiting by having distribution in the retailer, and you as the manufacturer, you’re benefiting on both sides.

Bradley Sutton: Okay. That sounds like a good deal too. So, really, licensing and the whole thing that encompasses it is not just one specific thing, and there’s a lot of different options and a lot of different things that one can do. So, quick question. Do you remember the AMPM Podcast?

Paul Miller: Oh, absolutely.

Bradley Sutton: I know you know Manny; you’ve talked to Manny before, and he thinks what you do is pretty awesome. So, but he wouldn’t say, “it’s pretty awesome.” What does he say?  The catch phrase.

Paul Miller: How cool is that.

Bradley Sutton: Oh, you got it. All right. I’ve been testing people lately on that. Not everybody gets it. There we go. So you remember it.

Paul Miller: I listen to that on my Cozy Phones almost every night.

Bradley Sutton: But not the PAW Patrol.

Paul Miller: No, but actually, what I really like now is the No BS Podcast.

Bradley Sutton: Oh, there we go. All right. Well the No BS that has BS, which is Bradley Sutton. Speaking of Manny and his podcast. I know you’ve been a user of Helium 10 for a while. What are some of your favorite uses for Helium 10 that even a seller of your level—four, six, seven, 8 million dollars, who knows what the future holds for you? What kind of use does a seven-figure seller like yourself get from Helium 10?

Paul Miller: Well I love the Profits tools. I’m in there every single day looking at the Profit tools. But just this morning, I had a Buy Box alert from some hijacker who took the Buy Box from me. So, I love the alerts. The alerts are great and the automatic email reports are just fabulous, but I’m most of the time in the Profit tools. Then when I’m tweaking my listings, I go over to all the other tools, and you and I have talked about this. In fact, I recall you doing a podcast—it might’ve been with Liran—where you’re talking about product display ads.

Bradley Sutton: That was actually from you! You gave me the idea for it.

Paul Miller: And the ASIN grabber, and we had that conversation a while back where you can go in there and grab the ASINs of all your competitors, and you use those to create a product display ads. I mean, there’s just no faster way to do that. So that’s just amazing.

Bradley Sutton: Yep. Yep. I still give you credit for that because I remember you asking me, “hey,” you had no idea that ASIN grabber was amazing. You were like, “Hey Bradley, can Helium 10 do this?” And I was like, “whoa, that is an excellent idea.” And I know a lot of people have gotten benefit from that. Well, Paul, I appreciate all the time you’ve given us today, and this is been a very unique episode. I don’t think very many people in this space, and definitely, we haven’t had anybody on the podcast before talking about licensing, but I hope it opened the eyes for a lot of people out there about some of the cool possibilities. People say, “supplements are saturated, phone cases are saturated,” but guess what, phone cases that are from Marshmallow the DJ are not saturated, because there’s probably nobody who has that license.” You do that and now all of a sudden you take a saturated market and you’ve got one of the most unique products out there that have demand. So I think people can appreciate the possibilities. If they would like more information that can be gotten from a 30-minute podcast, how can they reach out to you or find more information about licensing that you can help them with?

Paul Miller: I would recommend that anybody goes to licensing.org, which is run by LIMA, which is licensing industry manufacturers association, that will tell you where the events are. And every year there’s a big event in Las Vegas. It’s just happened in June. That was my first introduction to licensing.  I say if you can get out there and go to that a conference, it’ll be totally overwhelming. But there’s a lot of people that are helping out there. I highly recommend going to the licensing conference if you can. I also put together a free video course that people can go to if they want to. It’s at nextlevellicensing.com. Yeah, so you can check that out. It gives you the introduction. A lot of the piece goes a little deeper than we were able to do. I’m talking about the basic structure of licensing, so you can do that. And then if you go on Facebook and look for my group at Next Level Licensing, we have a Facebook group there too.

Bradley Sutton: Cool. Paul, it was great to talk to you again and hope to see you in person at a conference soon. And we’ll be interested to see your progress with your brand and we’ll see what you have in store for the rest of this year.